The January "Fabricating Update" included statistics and comments from the e-newsletter's recent survey about fabricator concerns. Some of the comments focused on the lack of skilled labor, an oft-cited concern in the fabricating industry and manufacturing as a whole.
This information garnered even more comments, such as a very thoughtful response from Todd, an Alabama reader whose signature included the aka: Skilled labor standing right here, willing to relocate!
Todd's response chronicles his experience as a skilled craftsman, paints a picture of what is happening in his part of the country, and raises a valid point about why employers might be having such a difficult time attracting qualified workers.
Here's what Todd had to say:
"I enjoyed reading the update as it had a great deal of useful information as to what others are seeing out there. I am a former manufacturing facility owner/operator (had to shut down in 2009), and now I am employed by a large Tier 1 auto supplier. I am their welding/fabrication supervisor, and I wanted to share what I see going on this region.
"To put it simply, there is no shortage of skilled labor in this area. The issue that persists now is the fact that no one is willing to pay for this labor. Reputable and large facilities are attempting to hire individuals to weld carbon steel, stainless, and aluminum, and the typical rate is $10 to $12 an hour.
"The minimum that I would start a qualified candidate off at my facility was $18 an hour, and after a probationary period, they were usually bumped to $20 an hour.
"After 6 to 12 months, I would evaluate their progress, and they could be bumped to as high as $25 an hour. After their second year of service, the rate could continue to go up as long as the work progression was there.
"I realize that I was somewhat of an exception, but the employers in this area are simply expecting something unrealistic. Heck, I was even contacted recently to be a 2nd shift supervisor for a different company and they offered $16 an hour for second shift. No thanks!
"I make a little more than that at my current employer, but it is nowhere near what I am used to making. Five years ago I was making almost $35 an hour doing the same or a little less work. Now, employers in this area expect you to work harder with less (or heavily used) equipment, work more hours, take on more responsibility ... all for less pay. Profit margins are through the roof for most in this area, but they cry about no skilled labor. Well, pay a respectable rate for what you want us to do!
"I can TIG (heavy in this process), MIG, and Stick weld almost any metal in any position, and I am willing to go anywhere on this planet for a better position. I send out 5 to 10 resumes per week (even explaining that I am willing to relocate), and yet there are no calls or replies of any sort.
"I have plenty of management (even ownership), sales, mechanical, and computer experience. I'm even a certified professional tennis instructor. The best that I can get is this $20 an hour job where they expect me and my team to perform miracles, which we often do. But, it is very frustrating.
"I am the only income my family has. I'm in my early 40s; I have a terrific wife (a former architect) that stays home and raises and home schools our four great kids, and I drive 53 miles one way to work every day. I want to work, and I will give my employers everything that I can give them. It's just tough to listen to all this mess about the lack of skilled labor when there are other issues that are not being addressed.
"Didn't mean to get into a rant there. The employers are crying only one side of this. They are not boasting about the ridiculously low pay they are offering. If this kind of work was easy, then everyone would be doing it.
"It takes a skilled individual to be able to read drawings from engineers that have no idea of how to properly fit something together, yet still fit it together correctly and weld it out and make it look like a robot welded it. That is what my team and I do every day.
"Employers want a resolution to their dilemma? Increase your pay rate to something someone can live off of and you will see the skilled labor appear. Once that skilled labor gets in the door, the profits will continue to be there because of the proficiency of that individual.
"For the record, I am not a union member of any sort, nor have I ever been.
"I hope that puts a different perspective on things for you and I would hope that you would share this with others. I can"t say this is the case for everywhere, but it is for my local area."
That's Todd's experience with wages for skilled workers. What's yours?
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About the Author: Vicki Bell
So how is all this skilled labor that is available making a living?? I do not for one second believe that they refuse to work simply because the area labor rates are low. If there are people willing to work for $20/hr, those same people will work for $12 if that is all that is available. The thesis of the piece, if I read it right, is that the skilled people are there, just not working because the jobs don't pay enough. Paying more will not make people magically appear, especially if those people are already there. Are we saying that these people are working somewhere else for more money? Where? Doing what? Everybody wants more money, especially me. However, to say that simply raising labor rates will result in skilled labor appearing that is already there is nonsense.
Ken,
I am the person that sent the original post to Vicki. I do believe that skilled workers are there and working elsewhere. The part that I do not agree with you is about the same people working for $20/hr will work for $12/hr doing the same work. There is other work in this area that pays more than that, so then the industry loses the skilled labor due to a higher paying position in a different industry. I do, however, agree that simply raising the pay rate is not going to have the skilled labor show up everywhere. It will be bring the untalented along with the skilled labor, making it difficult on the employer to sort through who can really do what.
If you do this sort of work daily, then Ken you know even some of the health hazards there are. Breathing the metal dust and welding fumes, dealing with heavy metal, and not to mention…working in a shop that is cooking at 120-130 degrees during an Alabama summer in full welding gear. It's rediculous for an employer to expect someone to get out there and do this type of work for $10-12/hour for a career.
Again, I will clearly state that this is the normal for my region. If there is doubt, then get on Monster or CareerBuilder and do a search for a Tig welder (which requires more skill), or look in your local newspaper classifieds and see what you come up with. There are many more factors to what it will take to repair this. The article that prompted my response to Vicki was feedback from employers discussing the record profits and amount of work they had on their plate, but crying about lack of skilled labor. My sole point was that there are plenty of skilled labor available and employers should take a look at both sides instead of just looking at their P&L statements.
Not trying to provoke you Ken. You do bring valid points from a different perspective, and your points should be considered as well. I can only hope that these posts (from everyone) inspire employers to take a different look than what they have been.
@Ken. I am a engineer who gets calls weekly and emails daily for jobs but they, but do not pay enough to warrant a move, or in many cases, for the job at hand. If employers want people so badly they will raise pay rates. Supply & Demand principles. Also with increased unemployment benefits(99 weeks) people can afford to wait out the $12hr jobs for the $20hr job.
I will tell you why they aren't doing those jobs. It is because they can work at Wal-Mart or any number of warehouse or even office jobs for the same money that is being offered to *skilled* labor and work in air conditioning instead of 115+ degree welding shops. I personally worked at the local Wal-Mart making a little over $10 an hour and it was 4 miles from my home. Why would someone expect you to work in a job that pays only slightly more in a difficult environment with little to no chance of advancement or increases in pay and typically NOT close to home for a whopping $2 an hour more? It's not that they are working somewhere else for more; it's that they are working easier jobs for the same money. The point is that you can't reasonably expect skilled labor to accept the work load/conditions for what is pretty much starting pay at many non-skilled labor jobs.
Not all employers are quite what you describe. We looked for almost a year for a competent, skilled welder/ fabricator and finally found one with not quite all the qualifications we wanted, but at least he was willing to learn.
I certainly am aware that most, if not all the men that work for me are a talented group of individuals with "a gift". These men couldn't complete the jobs they do without a true gifted ability. I pay these gentlemen full benefits and a wonderful salary.
There are employers out there that know their most valuable assest is not their facility or their machines, it is their dedicated and talented welders/fabricators.
Elizabeth,
Your company sounds much like what my manufacturing facility was like. I invested in my people, along with the building, equipment, etc… But the #1 emphasis was investing in my people. I do agree 100% that to do quality work in this industry, it does take someone with a gift. I am grateful, daily, of the gift that has been given to me.
From the sound of your reply, you have a very nice establishment, and I hope it remains that way. Keep up the good work. I do understand that my response is based on the average posting of what jobs are out there, and not every employer is the same. It is nice to hear that there are still exceptions out there.
Todd I think it has a lot to do with the greed of the employers out there. (A lot like our congress) There are employers out there that are not getting the profit margins they were getting 5 years ago. They are making money but not the money they were making. So instead of adjusting their (the owners) salaries they adjust their current labor or try to look for skilled labor they can get for half the price. Like congress does with taxes. Instead of adjusting their life style and lowering their pay, they increase our taxes so we work for less and they live high on the hog!! I know your response was not about politics. It does however show the root of a lot of the problems in our country today. There are a lot of people out there that don't care about the person but what they can get out of the person. Greed!!! We have lost touch with the roots of what this country was founded on. I think it is great that you have voiced your opinion. Keep up the good work!
Very well said Daniel! I also agree that we, as a country have lost touch with what we were founded upon!
I had to say something in response to the article. If I didn't, I think I would have imploded. I have seen both sides of the desk, ownership and the trenches. One side tends to be following the path of our country…forgetting what got them here….the people!
Again, well said Daniel!
I agree with what Todd B posted. There seems to be a race to the bottom in this country when it comes to blue collar/manufacturing jobs. Whether you agree with union's or not, it seems that attacking them for political reasons does nothing but suppresses wages for everyone else!
Thanks for the support Brad.
I own a welding shop and I think the numbers printed in the artical are nowhere near realistic with regards to wages. In Canada (where we are located), the lowest paid weldor makes $35 per hour. Our first year apprentices are $20 per hour and we pay our pressure welders $50/hr regular time and $75hr overtime. Our shop rate is $85 per hour so we dont make much margin. We have been advertising trying to find welders at these wages for almost 1 year now. We are constantly short staffed because our rates are low relative to the bigger companies. Most welders up north make around $20,000 per month with hourly rates between $70 and $100. I have heard of annual incomes exceeding the 300k mark.
The basic problem is that there are simply not enough welders (or tradesmen in general). There needs to be a more concerted effort by the governments and schools to train more tradesmen and encourage young people to enter the trades. When I was of school age, everyone said you have to go to university and get a degree to be successful in life. I think that too much focus has been on forcing people to go to school without learning how to work. Now the tides have changed. There are thousands of folks who have bachelors degrees but who cant find work and there are very few tradesmen. A 25year old tradesman in Canada can easily make $50 per hour. A 25 year old degreed person will probably make $15 per hour and be $50,000 in debt.
The result of all this is that shops are the ones who are suffering. Most of our competitors are simply closing shop in North America and moving to China where they can find welders for $2 per hour. We have no intention of doing this but we are finding it more and more difficult to compete. We are now starting to invest in automated welding equipment (orbital TIG) for our pressure pipe welds. This is not as easy as it sounds. One problem we discovered is that we need a J prep on each fitting which requires a machinist. Guess what – machinists in our area also want at least $50/hr if you can find one. So we are back to the same problem.
So bottom line is that I think there is a massive shortage of skilled labour in North America. We have heard that it is not much better in the US especially in places like Montana, Dakota's, Wyoming etc…. I dont venture south much but I can assure any tradesman that there is more than enough work to go around up North and the wages are higher that doctors or lawyers.
Sean,
Thanks for the very informative post. The information that I posted was specific to the region where I reside, (SE USA). Heck, a very good friend of mine, who taught me to Tig in the beginning, had to recently relocate to Atlanta just to score a job bringing in a hair over $20/hour. This fellow can Mig, Tig, and Stick just about anything (I haven't seen anything that he can't) in any position. When he's finished, it has the appearance of a robotic finish because of the consistancy.
By the way, congrats on the investment of the orbital Tig unit. Towards the end of my ownership of my manufacturing facility, I came so close to purchasing a nice Fanuk orbital Tig as well. To see that thing in operation was simply amazing. Unfortunately, the robot will replace human workers, but it seems that you don't have much of a choice. Maybe a group of us should move up to Northern Canada. Hey, I'm willing!
Likewise, the labor mkaert is apparently the one area of economic life where bargaining by the selling party is not considered a legitimate part of the price discovery process. Apparently the dictum that productivity determines wage levels means that you're supposed to take the first offer or leave it? no haggling allowed. I propose the economics of the labor market have been substantially changed so that the laborer is no longer the seller. Firms supply jobs. Individuals demand them. Minimum wage is the root.
@Shawn. In Michigan there are allot of shops trying to snag cheap welding labor for $10-12hr. I have a family member in the field and $20hr is not unheard of for a experienced welder that's been at a particular shop for a couple years. Usually the only ones they will get are beginners & Felons for that price but at that cut rate shops are willing to risk it because they can easily be replaced if they do not work out.
I want to applaud your blog for posting this response to the article. Regardless of which side of the fence you are on, these are the kinds of things that need to be discussed and really looked at. I firmly believe that too many employers have lost touch with the lives of their staff and too many employees have lost sight of the big picture in relation to the companies they work for. Sadly, one cannot survive without the other and only through people speaking up and drawing attention to the things do we have a chance to make positive changes for both sides of this equation.